Red Robin
Well-known member
I would if it looked like it had a future in it.Jinglebob said:
How many?
- Thread starter Jinglebob
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I think each person's idea's on whats best varies.
Here we calve march 1st our grass is best in june and early july if we calved in may and june those calves would never reap the benefit of good grass.
I don't pull my bulls as most do and always end up with about 10 late calves they are always small in the fall 350#s born in june they just don't gain very well here.I keep these over and sell them in the spring for grass cattle.I have rents to pay then so thats what I keep those calves for.Their are guys here who fall calve all feed the cows in hay rings with close access to water and a creap feeder for the calves.They have to fill the creap feeder and haul manure out in the spring due to the feeding option.They have told me that if the cow has to walk for water she will only drink once a day and at that they don't milk heavy enough to wean a big calf.
I chanced the way I calve this year I live 12 miles from my farm where the cows are wintered every spring I haul them home calve them and haul them back which was my plan this year till the day I was going to haul them.At the last minute I thought about the cost of hauling them I would drive up and check them during calveing instead well I go up in the morning and feed and tag calves and then go back at dark and check them again it is working just fine there have been 40 calves born there and I have only seen 1 being born and have not had any troubles so far.I did haul 40 1st calf heifers home and calve them here but they calved in Febuary.
If it was a very cold snowy or windy night I would go up and check them but they are cows and have been having calves for 1000s of years on their own they don't need me 24 hours a day..
Sometimes we create more work and expense by trying not to be lazy and being lazy is something I am very good at.
FERTILIZER many here spend $15,000 a year on hayfield's per year for a 200 cow outfit we tried it 2 years ago spent $1100 on one field got 43 more bales than the year before that figured out to over $25 per bale for the extra bales not worth it you can buy hay all over for $10 to $25 per bale here and most of it they will deliver if you will just buy it.I bought corn screenings last fall for $54 per ton delivered sometimes it pays to buy your feed and leave the diesel in the barrel.
Well I better go check cows as I haven't been there since last evening good day.
Here we calve march 1st our grass is best in june and early july if we calved in may and june those calves would never reap the benefit of good grass.
I don't pull my bulls as most do and always end up with about 10 late calves they are always small in the fall 350#s born in june they just don't gain very well here.I keep these over and sell them in the spring for grass cattle.I have rents to pay then so thats what I keep those calves for.Their are guys here who fall calve all feed the cows in hay rings with close access to water and a creap feeder for the calves.They have to fill the creap feeder and haul manure out in the spring due to the feeding option.They have told me that if the cow has to walk for water she will only drink once a day and at that they don't milk heavy enough to wean a big calf.
I chanced the way I calve this year I live 12 miles from my farm where the cows are wintered every spring I haul them home calve them and haul them back which was my plan this year till the day I was going to haul them.At the last minute I thought about the cost of hauling them I would drive up and check them during calveing instead well I go up in the morning and feed and tag calves and then go back at dark and check them again it is working just fine there have been 40 calves born there and I have only seen 1 being born and have not had any troubles so far.I did haul 40 1st calf heifers home and calve them here but they calved in Febuary.
If it was a very cold snowy or windy night I would go up and check them but they are cows and have been having calves for 1000s of years on their own they don't need me 24 hours a day..
Sometimes we create more work and expense by trying not to be lazy and being lazy is something I am very good at.
FERTILIZER many here spend $15,000 a year on hayfield's per year for a 200 cow outfit we tried it 2 years ago spent $1100 on one field got 43 more bales than the year before that figured out to over $25 per bale for the extra bales not worth it you can buy hay all over for $10 to $25 per bale here and most of it they will deliver if you will just buy it.I bought corn screenings last fall for $54 per ton delivered sometimes it pays to buy your feed and leave the diesel in the barrel.
Well I better go check cows as I haven't been there since last evening good day.
Jinglebob
Well-known member
CattleRMe said:
No, I don't have a scheme. Just was wondering. You mostly all sound like the people who say if they won the lottery, they would keep on doing the same thing that they do now. I believe most of you would. As FH said, it isn't just money, it's satisfaction.
You all replied just about as I thot' you would.
As far as change, I'll bet everyone of you has a neighbor or someone that does what you do, only different and probably doesn't work as hard and/or makes more money, but you are all satisfied with the way you are doing things. And there sure ain't nothing wrong with that.
Change MIGHT be for the better, but we all get pretty comfortable at what we do and where we are. We are people and people are funny critters! :wink:
Thanks for the answers and the reassurance!
Red Robin
Well-known member
Red Robin said:
I'm so open minded. Soapweed
Well-known member
Red Robin said:Red Robin said:
Oh, don't say that. It could be construed as "Liberal". :wink:
Here there are two bunches of calving cows. The larger herd are calving right now. As I look out my window at the blowing snowy conditions I do wonder what in the world we are thinking. The cows are checked an average of every two hours seems like they are lived with. However come fall and that extra weight I'll remember why.
The smaller bunch calves in August/September. They get checked 3 times a day and for the most part do well. Note these are all older cows. Last summer however we ran into some new babies dieing from the heat. That is all the vet could come up with. That was frustrating as we aren't really set up to battle the heat.
The smaller bunch calves in August/September. They get checked 3 times a day and for the most part do well. Note these are all older cows. Last summer however we ran into some new babies dieing from the heat. That is all the vet could come up with. That was frustrating as we aren't really set up to battle the heat.
Soapweed said:"There ain't no such thing as a free lunch."
"For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction."
"All is not gold that glitters."
There are always trade-offs, to every high-fangled new idea. Last year at this time, I was strongly considering selling all of our cow/calf pairs. We did sell a hundred. The more I tossed this idea around, the less it appealed to me. For one thing, if we sold all of our cattle, I'd either have to take in someone else's cattle or quit ranching. Our cattle are gentle and respect fences. If we took in cattle, there's no telling what kind of renegade fence-crawling obnoxious bovines would be involved. Then I'd always be at someone else's beck and call, and would have to toty to their every demand. Wondering if their money would come through would be another worry. Guess I'll do like jigs, and just sit here with my head in the sand and keep on doing the same old thing.
"Don't fix it if it ain't broke." :???: :? :wink:
now I have to share my sand???? I hope you bring the lemonade!
Now its clear why there are contented cows-
They've been raised by contented ranchers.
It is nice reading everybody is happy with their lives out there.
Way to go!
As for me, after deep consideration I'm sticking with
the current useless program: checking the cows by internet
and hanging around listening to what gives at the Coffee Shop
They've been raised by contented ranchers.
It is nice reading everybody is happy with their lives out there.
Way to go!
As for me, after deep consideration I'm sticking with
the current useless program: checking the cows by internet
and hanging around listening to what gives at the Coffee Shop
Jason
Well-known member
I'll wager that anyone who has been in the business more than 20 years has tried many different things to make less work/more money. Human nature being what it is, we tend to forget our ventures that didn't work quite as well as anticipated.
The net helped me remember some of my experiments, as new to cattle types always asked why why why? I had to think many times, why do I do that?
I have tried fall calving, worked for the time and reason I did it, but I no longer do it.
I have calved in May/June, I try not to anymore as it has its own unique problems, although with BSE, calving seasons lengthened as old cows weren't worth squat, a June calf was easier to move than the cow.
Some things that seem like a good idea in wet or normal moisture years are a disaster in drought years, and vice versa. In a growth phase some things might be done that are dropped when the ranch is big enough. Anyone who has survived any challenge in Ag has made changes, they just maybe forgot about them, or think they were just logical progression.
The net helped me remember some of my experiments, as new to cattle types always asked why why why? I had to think many times, why do I do that?
I have tried fall calving, worked for the time and reason I did it, but I no longer do it.
I have calved in May/June, I try not to anymore as it has its own unique problems, although with BSE, calving seasons lengthened as old cows weren't worth squat, a June calf was easier to move than the cow.
Some things that seem like a good idea in wet or normal moisture years are a disaster in drought years, and vice versa. In a growth phase some things might be done that are dropped when the ranch is big enough. Anyone who has survived any challenge in Ag has made changes, they just maybe forgot about them, or think they were just logical progression.
theHiredMansWife
Well-known member
Not me!!
Were I to win the lottery, we'd own this place, rather than just work here. :wink:
Red Robin
Well-known member
How about me saying I am a free thinker? If that won't work, how about confused? Ignorant? Nah, it's all still synominous with liberal.Soapweed said:Red Robin said:Red Robin said:
Oh, don't say that. It could be construed as "Liberal". :wink:
Tap
Well-known member
Sometimes, we as humans choose to ignore what we don't want to see. I think various methods of ranching will work in most any areas. Look around and see how different ranches are in a 20 mile radius from you.
I guess what I am trying to say is that there are tradeoff's no matter how you operate your ranch. Feed and early calving doesn't necessarily mean more profit at the end of the year. Or the opposite scenerio for that matter. I take offense sometimes when low cost ranching gets confused with poor management. Knowing when to spend money or not to probably is the biggest factor. Turn out dates, labor etc. probably have as much effect on management as anything.
Around here a lot of the most established ranches winter on cake and grass, and calve April or later, and take what mother nature hands out. I like to be able to get our calving cows back home during a storm, but that isn't always possible either. A lot of ranches around here barely have a barn big enough to put their horse in. And there are also lots that shed, or lot calve, and raise big old calves by fall. 600 lb. April/May born calves are common in this area though too.
One guy I like to work with real well, calves his first calvers as 2 and and half years old in the fall, runs the calves over to yearlings, then rolls the cows back into his spring herd as 4's. He has done a lot of penciling on this and with the limited improvements on that ranch, he may well have it figured out. His insurance costs etc. are practically nothing.
Anyone else heard of this type of operation?
The best part of it is we get to brand over there spring and fall some years. :wink:
I guess what I am trying to say is that there are tradeoff's no matter how you operate your ranch. Feed and early calving doesn't necessarily mean more profit at the end of the year. Or the opposite scenerio for that matter. I take offense sometimes when low cost ranching gets confused with poor management. Knowing when to spend money or not to probably is the biggest factor. Turn out dates, labor etc. probably have as much effect on management as anything.
Around here a lot of the most established ranches winter on cake and grass, and calve April or later, and take what mother nature hands out. I like to be able to get our calving cows back home during a storm, but that isn't always possible either. A lot of ranches around here barely have a barn big enough to put their horse in. And there are also lots that shed, or lot calve, and raise big old calves by fall. 600 lb. April/May born calves are common in this area though too.
One guy I like to work with real well, calves his first calvers as 2 and and half years old in the fall, runs the calves over to yearlings, then rolls the cows back into his spring herd as 4's. He has done a lot of penciling on this and with the limited improvements on that ranch, he may well have it figured out. His insurance costs etc. are practically nothing.
Anyone else heard of this type of operation?
The best part of it is we get to brand over there spring and fall some years. :wink:
Jinglebob
Well-known member
Tap said:
Sounds like a good enough reason to me! :wink:
Dad told of those oldtimers who calved their cows for the first time as 3 year olds. He thought they had about as much trouble as when we calved 2 year olds. He always thot' a cow deserved a second chance and would run dry cows over. And he believed in keeping fence crawlers. And he didn't sort his replacement heifers while they were still sucking the cow. He also kept them dang old prolapsing cows we'd have to sew up, every spring, before they calved. Seeing as how he didn't sort his reps. off from the cows, we ended up with more of them dang prolapsers! And the fence crawlers did a real good job of teaching their calves how to do it!
I don't agree with any of those, so don't do it. He was here for about 40 years and I've been running it about 15 now, so time will tell who was right. Maybe both of us!
Things change and the only thing that doesn't change is that all things will change.
I am a firm believer in doing the oppisite of what most others are doing, as best I can. When they sell, I want to buy. When they buy, I want to sell.
As long as it pencils out and I am enjoying what I am doing, I will do about what ever it takes to make a go of it.
But I do have to enjoy it. Weeellll, most of it. :wink:
PureCountry
Well-known member
I'm comin' at this from a little different angle. I grew up in a purebred Angus operation, calving in Jan/Feb, marketing seedstock, hitting the show circuit hard, consigning cattle to this sale and that, high inputs, and high risk. If anything, it taught me what I don't want to do. I don't want to farm grainland, or play "Politically Correct" with swapping high priced cattle back and forth.
6 years ago, I started taking over the ranch from my folks after working in various other things for years. And one of the first things I did, was sell off all of the bottom end cows for them, taking my pick of the top end. We've pretty much switched every aspect of the operation 180 degrees. This is no longer a mixed operation. It is a grass-based operation, and the only steel we have is panels and an old bale truck. All the other equipment is made of leather, pretty much. Other than maybe the frying pan the wife uses to keep me in check once in awhile. :lol:
We follow holistic management principles - although I haven't taken a course and didn't know we fell under that "label" until meeting some holistic managers. We do everything as low-cost as possible, without sacrificing the proper care we give our stock. From the cattle through to Molly our Wolfhound, everything is properly cared for. We calve in June/July, and love it. I'm calving my Grandad's cows right now, and it just doesn't make sense to calve them in this winter weather, now that we've had one crop of summer calving under our belts.
Anyway, my point is, we weren't happy with what we were doing, mainly b/c the wife and I both want to be at home raising our children and running our ranch in an economically and environmentally sustainable manner. So, we changed. We changed ALOT, and we're still changing. We switched to Galloway herd bulls, and are VERY pleased with the results. We switched to June calving, and we're happy. We just bought some purebred Galloway cows, and we'll see how that goes. We plan on grassing our yearlings and selling grass-finished beef.
I'm not afraid of change, b/c it's worked well for me. If some of the changes in the future don't work well, will I fear change? No, I'll just evaluate what I did wrong, and change again. :wink:
6 years ago, I started taking over the ranch from my folks after working in various other things for years. And one of the first things I did, was sell off all of the bottom end cows for them, taking my pick of the top end. We've pretty much switched every aspect of the operation 180 degrees. This is no longer a mixed operation. It is a grass-based operation, and the only steel we have is panels and an old bale truck. All the other equipment is made of leather, pretty much. Other than maybe the frying pan the wife uses to keep me in check once in awhile. :lol:
We follow holistic management principles - although I haven't taken a course and didn't know we fell under that "label" until meeting some holistic managers. We do everything as low-cost as possible, without sacrificing the proper care we give our stock. From the cattle through to Molly our Wolfhound, everything is properly cared for. We calve in June/July, and love it. I'm calving my Grandad's cows right now, and it just doesn't make sense to calve them in this winter weather, now that we've had one crop of summer calving under our belts.
Anyway, my point is, we weren't happy with what we were doing, mainly b/c the wife and I both want to be at home raising our children and running our ranch in an economically and environmentally sustainable manner. So, we changed. We changed ALOT, and we're still changing. We switched to Galloway herd bulls, and are VERY pleased with the results. We switched to June calving, and we're happy. We just bought some purebred Galloway cows, and we'll see how that goes. We plan on grassing our yearlings and selling grass-finished beef.
I'm not afraid of change, b/c it's worked well for me. If some of the changes in the future don't work well, will I fear change? No, I'll just evaluate what I did wrong, and change again. :wink:
Jinglebob
Well-known member
PureCountry said:
There you go! :wink:
Big Muddy rancher
Well-known member
No, I don't have a scheme. Just was wondering. You mostly all sound like the people who say if they won the lottery, they would keep on doing the same thing that they do now.
I didn't know we were going to win the lottery. heck i'll just keep ranching until it's all gone. :cowboy:
I didn't know we were going to win the lottery. heck i'll just keep ranching until it's all gone. :cowboy:
WB
Well-known member
There are always decisions that affect us a lot more than we realize at the time we make the decision. But if someone can show me how to get more for less sign me up today. Yea I am guilty of doing things the same as we always have done but I do try to keep an open mind on ways to improve.
Tap
Well-known member
Jinglebob, this may not exactly be on topic, but this is an example of keeping an open mind when doing things.
Several years ago we used to own some land almost 30 miles north of our main holdings. We always hauled cow/calf pairs up to this ranch in the spring, and mainly trailed them home in the fall.
This ranch laid on a main hiway, and coming home we went down the ditch and back and forth across the road as we needed to. We even crossed a bridge right on the hiway where it was unhandy to go around it. Well when we finally got home it was time to wean the calves, so we assembled some of the neighbors to help us on weaning day. We had the cattle at a very old ranchsite across the hiway from where we were to end up with the calves. This ranch had very meager corrals on it. We originally planned to sort off the calves and haul several trailer loads over to where we wanted them. My dad says why don't we just take a few old pet cows and turn the calves out with them and head them home. I was very skeptical of this as I don't like problems when they can be avoided. Nobody else seemed to disapprove of the idea so we just turned the calves out and started pushing them across the hiway. They trailed across like a bunch of old milk cows. We were sitting around drinking coffee before we could have hardly loaded 2 horse trailers with calves. This was about 2 miles away from where we started so there was no danger of the cows hearing the calves and crossing the road themselves.
I am sure the long trip home made the calves a lot better about crosssing the hiway and trailing off, but I will always be amazed how well it worked that day.
Keep an open mind. :wink:
Several years ago we used to own some land almost 30 miles north of our main holdings. We always hauled cow/calf pairs up to this ranch in the spring, and mainly trailed them home in the fall.
This ranch laid on a main hiway, and coming home we went down the ditch and back and forth across the road as we needed to. We even crossed a bridge right on the hiway where it was unhandy to go around it. Well when we finally got home it was time to wean the calves, so we assembled some of the neighbors to help us on weaning day. We had the cattle at a very old ranchsite across the hiway from where we were to end up with the calves. This ranch had very meager corrals on it. We originally planned to sort off the calves and haul several trailer loads over to where we wanted them. My dad says why don't we just take a few old pet cows and turn the calves out with them and head them home. I was very skeptical of this as I don't like problems when they can be avoided. Nobody else seemed to disapprove of the idea so we just turned the calves out and started pushing them across the hiway. They trailed across like a bunch of old milk cows. We were sitting around drinking coffee before we could have hardly loaded 2 horse trailers with calves. This was about 2 miles away from where we started so there was no danger of the cows hearing the calves and crossing the road themselves.
I am sure the long trip home made the calves a lot better about crosssing the hiway and trailing off, but I will always be amazed how well it worked that day.
Keep an open mind. :wink:
Jinglebob
Well-known member
yup. but don't open it so far that your brains fall out! :shock: :lol: :lol: :lol:
