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reader (the Second)
Rancher
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 5221
Location: Northern Virginia
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 Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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Well, I think it's great that Jinglebob's son is becoming a priest. I consider clergypeople and high school principals to be important role models, teachers, and leaders for all of us and especially the young. We need smart, good people to go into these avocations.
Personally I think lifelong celibacy is too much to ask from most people, although some can live that way.
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theHiredMansWife
Rancher
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 1219
Location: southwest corner of the Sandhills
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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And I don't think being bound for the priesthood should suddenly nullify his opinion on the subject, either. That's like the people who always say men's opinions shouldn't count as much as women's. I don't really see that.
It's often easier for them to make sanctimonious pronouncements, but a truly well thought out opinion should be respected from everyone.
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Silver
Rancher
Joined: 23 Mar 2005
Posts: 1432
Location: BC
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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| theHiredMansWife wrote: |
And I don't think being bound for the priesthood should suddenly nullify his opinion on the subject, either. That's like the people who always say men's opinions shouldn't count as much as women's. I don't really see that.
It's often easier for them to make sanctimonious pronouncements, but a truly well thought out opinion should be respected from everyone. |
Well said.
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Jinglebob
Rancher
Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 5727
Location: Western South Dakota
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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| deleted it was a mistrake of the ol' fat fingers. see the following post
Last edited by Jinglebob on Wed Mar 15, 2006 5:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jinglebob
Rancher
Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 5727
Location: Western South Dakota
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Silver wrote: |
Well Jinglebob, it's unfortunate that someone who is so normally rational in thought as yourself has been so soundly beaten at every point by someone such as ole Dis here.
SORRY, I BEG TO DISAGREE.
You are quite clear in that you think a zygot is a human being and accorded all the rights of a human being. That it's never ok to kill a baby. That it's a baby from conception. So, when does it stop being a baby?
OUR LAW CONSIDERS NOT BEING A BABY AS TEEnAGE, AND AS ADULT AT 18 TO 21 CONSIDERING THE LAW.
When does it become ok to kill this child?
NEVER. AND WHEN DID IT BECOME A CHILD INSTEAD OF A BABY?
Something tells me (I might be wrong here) that you think the death penalty is ok.
FOR ONCE YOU GOT SOMETHING RIGHT. I DON'T BELIEVE IN THE DEATH PENALTY
(So it's ok to kill this child when it's a little older....). Perhaps you back the war in Iraq (put a little age on the child, slap him in a uniform, point him east and send him off to die), or possibly kill someone else's baby (of indeterminate age).
I GUESS I SHOULD CLEAR UP THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN KILLING AND MURDERING. KILLING TO PROTECT OR PROVENT SOMEONE ELSES DEATH IS FINE. MURDER (WHAT YOU DO WHEN YOU ABORT A CHILD) IS NEVER FINE. IF THE PRESIDENT AND CONGRESS FEEL THAT WE NEED TO GO TO WAR TO PREVENT MURDER TO OUR CITIZENS, THEN YES, I AM FOR THIS WAR. I HAD A SON WHO PROUDLY SERVED AND SEVERAL NEPHEWS AND A NIECE ALSO IN THE LINE OF FIRE. THEY SERVED SO WE MAY HAVE OUR RIGHTS.IF YOU'VE GOT A PROBLEM WITH THIS WAR, TELL THE POLITICIONS AND THE TERRORISTS. DON'T WHINE AT ME.
Obviously there must be a line somewhere where it becomes ok to kill these children then?
IT'S NEVER OK MURDER A CHILD. I GUESS IF A CHILD (UNDER THE AGE OF 18 OR 21)COMES AT YOU WITH A LOADED GUN AND FIRES, WITH INTENT TO MURDER YOU OR YOUR FAMILY OR EVEN ANY OTHER INNOCENT PERSON, THEN IT WOULD BE PERMITTED TO KILL THAT CHILD. BUT IT WOULDN'T BE MURDER ON YOUR PART. IT WOULD BE DEFENSE. |
The problem with so many people like dis and you is that you seem to either just skim over what others write, or you don't understand the content. Dis likes to change others words and won't answer any questions as to what she/he/it believes. I believe that I've made my case ubundentley clear and there is not the slightest chance in hell to get anyone with a different mindset to change their mind or ideas. So therefore I am done with this thread and any future ones. If you feel that you and the rest of those who believe in murdering pre born children, want to believe that this means you win, so be it. We all have to attone to our maker someday. I hope you all have good luck with that. I will pray for all of you.
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reader (the Second)
Rancher
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 5221
Location: Northern Virginia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Jinglebob wrote: |
| Silver wrote: |
Well Jinglebob, it's unfortunate that someone who is so normally rational in thought as yourself has been so soundly beaten at every point by someone such as ole Dis here.
SORRY, I BEG TO DISAGREE.
You are quite clear in that you think a zygot is a human being and accorded all the rights of a human being. That it's never ok to kill a baby. That it's a baby from conception. So, when does it stop being a baby?
OUR LAW CONSIDERS NOT BEING A BABY AS TEEnAGE, AND AS ADULT AT 18 TO 21 CONSIDERING THE LAW.
When does it become ok to kill this child?
NEVER. AND WHEN DID IT BECOME A CHILD INSTEAD OF A BABY?
Something tells me (I might be wrong here) that you think the death penalty is ok.
FOR ONCE YOU GOT SOMETHING RIGHT. I DON'T BELIEVE IN THE DEATH PENALTY
(So it's ok to kill this child when it's a little older....). Perhaps you back the war in Iraq (put a little age on the child, slap him in a uniform, point him east and send him off to die), or possibly kill someone else's baby (of indeterminate age).
I GUESS I SHOULD CLEAR UP THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN KILLING AND MURDERING. KILLING TO PROTECT OR PROVENT SOMEONE ELSES DEATH IS FINE. MURDER (WHAT YOU DO WHEN YOU ABORT A CHILD) IS NEVER FINE. IF THE PRESIDENT AND CONGRESS FEEL THAT WE NEED TO GO TO WAR TO PREVENT MURDER TO OUR CITIZENS, THEN YES, I AM FOR THIS WAR. I HAD A SON WHO PROUDLY SERVED AND SEVERAL NEPHEWS AND A NIECE ALSO IN THE LINE OF FIRE. THEY SERVED SO WE MAY HAVE OUR RIGHTS.IF YOU'VE GOT A PROBLEM WITH THIS WAR, TELL THE POLITICIONS AND THE TERRORISTS. DON'T WHINE AT ME.
Obviously there must be a line somewhere where it becomes ok to kill these children then?
IT'S NEVER OK MURDER A CHILD. I GUESS IF A CHILD (UNDER THE AGE OF 18 OR 21)COMES AT YOU WITH A LOADED GUN AND FIRES, WITH INTENT TO MURDER YOU OR YOUR FAMILY OR EVEN ANY OTHER INNOCENT PERSON, THEN IT WOULD BE PERMITTED TO KILL THAT CHILD. BUT IT WOULDN'T BE MURDER ON YOUR PART. IT WOULD BE DEFENSE. |
The problem with so many people like dis and you is that you seem to either just skim over what others write, or you don't understand the content. Dis likes to change others words and won't answer any questions as to what she/he/it believes. I believe that I've made my case ubundentley clear and there is not the slightest chance in hell to get anyone with a different mindset to change their mind or ideas. So therefore I am done with this thread and any future ones. If you feel that you and the rest of those who believe in murdering pre born children, want to believe that this means you win, so be it. We all have to attone to our maker someday. I hope you all have good luck with that. I will pray for all of you. |
The fact that you don't believe in the death penalty makes you consistent.
I did not used to believe in the death penalty and I think I still don't but sometimes, sometimes I wonder mostly because we let sociopaths back out into society and they kill again. If we really put sociopaths away for life, I would be able to be opposed to the death penalty.
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Silver
Rancher
Joined: 23 Mar 2005
Posts: 1432
Location: BC
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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Jinglebob, lumping into the same category as Dis is an insult I take quite personally. I haven't stated where I actually stand on these issues personally because I feel that doing so diminishes the philisophical side of the debate. If you seem to think it's pertinent, then here it is:
1: against abortion unless absolutely necessary and early (I don't know enough to make an informed opinion on what it early enough to be humane)
2: for the war in Afganistan, I support our troops all the way.
3: for the war in Iraq, now that you are there, although I don't support the original reasons for going
4: havn't formed a solid opinion on the death penalty..... I struggle with the ethics
So don't go off giving me your holier than thou attitude, I don't deserve it. If you want to discuss something using some logic I would be happy to accomadate, if I can. In the mean time I will pray for you also.
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Soapweed
Rancher
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 6656
Location: northern Nebraska Sandhills
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Disagreeable wrote: |
Not just a man...who can walk away from a pregnancy and never invest a cent or a moment of his time into it.
But a priest...who will never (or almost never) produce or raise a child, pay the rent, worry about where the next pair of shoes will come from.
Oh, that's someone whose opinion I would certainly respect in the abortion debate. (Sarcasam intended)  |
You seem to think it is a "man thing" to be against abortion. Nearly all the ladies I know are against abortion. Of course, they mostly are Republican Christian ranch ladies, with common sense. They are the kind that take personal responsibility for their own actions.
Democrats have the opinion that the government owes them a living, and that the government should pay for their abortions of convenience. They are more apt to get high on mind altering substances, and plumb lose track of their personal actions. Alas, gee, golly, all of a sudden, through no fault of their own, they turn up pregnant. It is a basic "entitlement" to be able to eradicate the little fetus, go on with life, and no questions should be asked.
It would be interesting to see the breakdown of pregnancies that end in abortion. I am betting a fairly small percentage are caused by rape or incest. The vast majority of abortions are just a convenient way to avoid an unwanted pregnancy.
Killing little unborn babies is just plain murder because those babies don't have a chance. Capital punishment is acceptable, because the perpetrators of heinous crimes deserve to lose their lives for what they have done.
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Jinglebob
Rancher
Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 5727
Location: Western South Dakota
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Silver wrote: |
Jinglebob, lumping into the same category as Dis is an insult I take quite personally. I haven't stated where I actually stand on these issues personally because I feel that doing so diminishes the philisophical side of the debate. If you seem to think it's pertinent, then here it is:
1: against abortion unless absolutely necessary and early (I don't know enough to make an informed opinion on what it early enough to be humane)
2: for the war in Afganistan, I support our troops all the way.
3: for the war in Iraq, now that you are there, although I don't support the original reasons for going
4: havn't formed a solid opinion on the death penalty..... I struggle with the ethics
So don't go off giving me your holier than thou attitude, I don't deserve it. If you want to discuss something using some logic I would be happy to
accomadate, if I can. In the mean time I will pray for you also. |
Thank you for having the courtesy of summing up where you stand. Didn't mean to come off holier than thou. I imagine there are a large bunch of people in this world who are better people than me.
As for lumping you with dis, from what you wrote earlier, it sounded like you were on her side of the argument, so your either for or against or your crotch is gettin' sore! 
Sorry if I offended you. And I dang sure can use all the prayers I can get. So if you weren't being sarcastic, thanks! 
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Silver
Rancher
Joined: 23 Mar 2005
Posts: 1432
Location: BC
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| Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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My grandfather, God rest his soul, allways claimed you could learn something from anyone. Well, he didn't word it quite that nicely, but I try to live by that. I would never discount something out of hand just because someone I don't like said it. If it's a good point, it's a good point based on it's merits, and I'll listen to it. Even if its from the other side of the argument.
Free thinking is what this great country is built on and I intend to carry it on.
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Jinglebob
Rancher
Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 5727
Location: Western South Dakota
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Silver
Rancher
Joined: 23 Mar 2005
Posts: 1432
Location: BC
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