R-Calf Gong Show

[Oldtimer]

[Tam]

[quote="Sandhusker"]Tam, you can say what you want about food safety etc..., but you can't ignore that the score on BSE positives is still Canada 4- US 0. Will we find a native case here? I don't think anybody would be surprised if we do, but as of today, we haven't.[/quote]

Let us talk about food safety Canada 0 US 1 for BSE infected animals found in the food chain. I'm not ignoring the fact Canada had 4 cases but you seem to ignor that one of those cases was in the US and in your food chain when talking about FOOD SAFETY . The US fell short in the food safety issue not Canada. And whether you find a case or not will probably be another fluke as the USDA sure isn't doing a great job of looking for one are they. I have a harder time trusting the US system after the Washington cow was found in the food chain than I do Canada's system that has had 3 that didn't make it to the food chain.

[M Gravlee]

Tam,
If you check 'Disable BBCode in this post' quotes won't work. They require BBCode.

[Murgen]

Every country in the world has a problem trusting the Americans, do you think this only comes down to food safety, remember weapons of mass destruction. We are judged on all our dealings with the outside world, not just our beef. Remember Canada's stance, "we don't think there are WMD" who was right? Wear your Canadian flag when you're in Europe Oldtimer, I worry about your safety! We'd hate to lose someone who posts such insightful copies of part articles!

[Oldtimer]

[don]

oldtimer: You blame this all on R-CALF-- but from their last position statement it looks like NCBA and its members don't buy into this "North American Beef" idea either

i don't think the idea that the herds aren't irreversibly mixed will have any more credibility outside the usa just because ncba wishes it were so. it may be something that more ranchers would like to believe but that doesn't make it any more valid. it isn't canada you have to convince; it's all the countries who still aren't taking your product. the onus is on canada to justify to ther countries that our beef is safe enough for their people to eat. it looks like several countries are placing the same expectations on the usa.

[Tam]

[quote="Oldtimer"][quote="don"] sandhusker, the rest of the world knows the two herds have been mixed so it's futile for r-calf to deny it. [/quote]

You blame this all on R-CALF-- but from their last position statement it looks like NCBA and its members don't buy into this "North American Beef" idea either.......[/quote]

When are you going to get it it doesn't really matter what R-CALF or NCBA believe, it is what Japan and Korea and the rest of your exporting partners see and they see this as a system that is so intrigrated that we are as one. They told the trade delegations back in Jan 2004 that and it doesn't look to me as if they have changed their minds. If they had you could get back your export markets by claiming it was an imported case. But the OIE said you can not dismiss the signifiance of BSE in the US as an imported case because the Washington cow couldn't be considered in isolation from the whole cattle production system in NORTH AMERICA. This is a North American BSE problem in their eyes and it really doesn't matter what you or I think.
Personally I don't want to be tied to the US system because you are looseing credibility daily and Canada has a system that has proven to be working with trace back and compliance to feed bans and a testing system that is finding the odd new case but the firewalls are also keeping them out of the food chain.

[Murgen]

OT-I would appreciate it if you just answer yes or no to these questions. A yes/no answer will be sufficient, you've probably heard that before. And I know you have respect for the basis that the US justice system/law was built. On truth and concise answers!

1) R-calf contends that Canadian animals are contaminated, ever since the feed ban in 1997? yes or no?

2) Have the number of Canadian animals in the US at any one time in the last 5 years, exceeded 1 million animals? Yes or No?

3) Are these animals not being culled at the same rate as Canadian older animals, yes or no?

4) Are they all being condemned? Yes or No?

Are the majority not being killed for human consumption, yes or no?

5) By your yes and no answers I will take that as you and R-calf are stating that the US beef supply is not safe and that we as consumers should never eat beef again!

[Oldtimer]

[Murgen]

OT-Actually they (Japan) has said they will treat Canada the same as the US, I'll try to find the link! So, as you're negotiating with the Japanese, you're also working for Canadian Beef. Thanks for the help!

[Oldtimer]

[Sandhusker]

I have a hard believing Japan views the US and Canada as a single North American herd. My reasoning is this; Do you recall what Japan's actions to us were following your first case in May 2003? If they saw the US and Canada as integrated, they would of closed their borders to us at the same time they closed to you. They did not. Instead, they demanded we show them we would be able to seperate your beef from ours for their markets. They did not close to the US until the Washington cow. Their actions show to me that they see our industries as closely related, but yet seperate.

They have maintained their zero tolerance policy towards BSE. The USDA was committed to the same until May 23, 2003. You can guess what changed the USDA's minds.